Rhino 3D and Grasshopper used by Leonie Tenthof van Noorden


Leonie Tenthof van Noorden is using Rhino 3D for designing clothes and building an avatar from a 3D scan, and scripts it with Grasshopper (you can see the Grasshopper visualized programming in the example). Also notice how the dress has lots of ease, it doesn’t fit snugly.

Valentina is aimed to do something similar, except Valentina’s clothes will fit better because we’ll get the measurements and avatar from 3D (same as this example) but create a more precise garment pattern in 2D then push it over into 3D. It’s the 2D pattern that makes the difference.

http://www.dezeen.com/2015/02/28/movie-3d-scanning-fashion-unique-fitted-clothes-leonie-tenthof-van-noorden/On Sun, Mar 8, 2015 at 10:15 AM, Susan Spencer susan.spencer@gmail.com wrote:

Yep. Here’s the current Valentina Logo.

On Sun, Mar 8, 2015 at 10:09 AM, Matt Daw matt.daw@gmail.com wrote:

Do you have your Valentina Logo in SVG?

On Sun, Mar 8, 2015 at 3:06 PM, Susan Spencer susan.spencer@gmail.com wrote:

This sounds good.

If you are considering doing a demo, I leave for San Francisco next Saturday (Mar. 14). It would help to raise money and get people on board if we’ve got some images to show. 3D captures everyone’s big attention these days.

The demo isn’t expected to show a finished product, it can be less than optimal, the expectation is that it’s a preliminary work to indicate what work remains to be done.

If you can make some sort of slide show (5 to 7 slides is good) which outline the workflow that would be very helpful.

On Sun, Mar 8, 2015 at 9:31 AM, Matt Daw matt.daw@gmail.com wrote:

I was thinking of loading Western Male in yes, and then using avastar to create a second life character on another layer and adjusting the character to suit dimensions.

As ever though there are issues. Avastar uses a nice smoother mesh, second lifes actual mesh (that they link to from their “fitted mesh wiki”) is pretty rough (not suitable without subdivision for cloth modelling). Both avastar (which quite rightly has to closely mirror second life) and second lifes mesh suffer from a few oddities when making males - some shapes i have used have created a little bit of a protrusion.

-Update I did do this and cannot acheive accuracy and the sliders values for second life do not relate to dressmaking measurements…(I actually think the way it works is quite clever just not accurate enough)

Makehuman 1.0.7 alpha (back to where i compared old MH mesh topology again) however has different mesh and a T-Pose suited to Second Life rigging… This version is also python (probably will appeal to Blender Coders) Version 2.72 => of Blender has the cloth plugin as part of the release.

Makehuman 1.0.7 alpha looks less “athlectic” from the outset (compared to the later catch-all mesh - which i use as a reference to how they made nicer topology but adjusted the pose), the advantage also being that the export with second life rig also works (collada has to be selected as the preferred export) - this version also pre-dated “fitted mesh” - which is to our advantage (this means we retain our models dimensions and the sliders dont adjust it - nor does an underlying “shape” worn by an avatar “adjust” ours unwantedly).

How does this relate back again?

We could have OpenSim as our “catwalk”, have Makehuman 1.0.7 as our mannequin (ideally minus head hands and feet as i have never found that part of it to be particularly pleasing - (sausages and a weird face :slight_smile: - opinion of course, and doesnt affect our testing - just the professionalism is based on good skin, hair, hands feet face shoes - as well as clothes and a catwalk…), Blender as our 3D cloth simulator and Valentina as our CAD.

I am thinking now of taking a default model - unless you have an idea of a model to use in MH, then modelling a catwalk and saving it as an OAR file - this can then be loaded from the command line of opensim and a second life client can then log in to local host - see a catwalk and upload both their MH mannequin and Blender Mesh…?

I prefer not to simulate the clothes and make them in Blender though as I am speedier in Marvelous. I will however do it as Dismine’s obj export work will not be “stitchable” in Marvelous (a feature I imagine they will hold back on for as long as possible seeing as it is in their high end expensive CLO package) but will be in Blender. But for our testing I’ll continue in Marvelous.

On Sat, Mar 7, 2015 at 1:25 AM, Susan Spencer susan.spencer@gmail.com wrote:

So we import Western Male into Blender then scale it to fit the measurements that we feed it. By ‘scale’ you mean ‘use sliders’?

On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 6:59 PM, Matt Daw matt.daw@gmail.com wrote:

Ah well this is the issue with the obj format and how i pointed to how software packages all went their own directions with how they intepreted scale. In second life you only have a height slider that you can reference from. the rest is a slding scale from 0-100. what we can do is use an avatar we know has measurements in a format that is considered “sane and stable” our Western Male. and try to make our game character (using the blender avastar plugin) scale to fit. comparing layers. This technique which sounds “sloppy” is the one used for your “body labs” link i replied to here - i cant be 100% sure though, as I dont know if it takes point cloud information.

  • plus some deformation to make it more accurate.

On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 11:24 PM, Susan Spencer < susan.spencer@gmail.com> wrote:

It would need to show the workflow in a minimal way:

  1. default avatar + measurements = new avatar

  2. new avatar + custom-sized pattern = clothes on avatar

It doesn’t have to use actual measurements from an actual user, just assume measurements come from Valentina. It doesn’t have to use actual 3D pattern from Valentina, just assume pattern shown is from Valentina. It doesn’t have to show choices of fabric on the clothes, just a blank default fabric or texture, just assume those options will be there.

Does this help?

On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 4:15 PM, Matt Daw matt.daw@gmail.com wrote:

What would the demo need to include?

Key points?

On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 4:46 PM, Susan Spencer < susan.spencer@gmail.com> wrote:

Hey Matt!

How soon can you work up a proof-of-concept demo ? I’m going to San Francisco in a week to show off this project. I know that’s not much lead time…

About Blender - Ton Roosendaal was very supportive at the very first Libre Graphics presentation about creating open source fashion software in 2010. If you can create a proof-of-concept demo, then we can get programmers on board to improve the Blender portion of the workflow because they’ll know we’re ready for them. They’re eager to show off Blender’s capabilities.

On Thu, Mar 5, 2015 at 8:07 PM, Matt Daw matt.daw@gmail.com wrote:


I have been thinking about the idea of modelling this catwalk, using something like valentina to do the pattern pieces (although i can use any CAD i just like your concepts and want to make a good thing work :)) to export OBJ mesh simulate some form of clothing from it (to show its usefulness) then make the catwalk, the opensim concept a workflow. I just dont find blender something I enjoy - although it is a very advanced program.

I would like to see more of blenders cloth stitching - so far i hear it is still a little immature in comparisson to marvelous designer.

On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 1:41 AM, Matt Daw matt.daw@gmail.com wrote:

Maybe if you like the idea we model a catwalk together in second life and i show you some of the fashions here :slight_smile:

On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 12:19 AM, Susan Spencer < susan.spencer@gmail.com> wrote:

Very cool.

On Thu, Mar 5, 2015 at 6:17 PM, Matt Daw matt.daw@gmail.com wrote:

sure is, been doing it for 4 years :slight_smile:

On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 12:13 AM, Susan Spencer < susan.spencer@gmail.com> wrote:

Wow, thanks for all the information. Is this the correct workflow?

Step 1: MD Singularity Viewer exports 2nd Life avatar with known measurements as XML --> Blender Avastar plugin imports XML data

Step 2: Blender Avastar resizes avatar using sliders exports as .obj –> 2ndLife Singularity Viewer --> Open Sim Server to re-pose avatar

On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 9:43 AM, Matt Daw matt.daw@gmail.com wrote:

Yes I will be upgrading my kinect to Version 2, although I am not optimistic about the surface scanning detai 0.8-1mm. I am more into russian 3d wrap with kinect v2 to see if the make human geometry for retopology can par well with Kinect. -This of course is 350 dollar commercial licensing again. - And once again I feel I am shooting in the dark (no real information on the subject matter and only commercial options offered - which I feel limits me to services I am tied in to).

-Funny how this is where I see makehuman become useful, as a mesh for retopology. - Or as a shape to be altered via point cloud information.

Also I found this white paper on the concept of taking reference points and filling in geometry:


It would be great if we could take measurements some how across the “Z” axis and create our own mannequins (something I have been trying to research for you) so that with basic tools we could create “In house” our own cut + assemble mannequins.

[image: Inline image 2][image: Inline image 1]

http://www.miralab.ch//repository/papers/428.pdf - Talks about a deformation model.

Interestingly I have another Idea we can “borrow” from: Second Life.

The viewers are open source, the “open sim” server is open source, there exists a plugin for blender called “Avastar” (few dollars) to translate xml data exported from second life to a 3d model to “dress” or “pose”. I have already linked a model for “Marvelous Designer” to which we know the measurements for, the second life avatar - athough crude geometry could be loaded onto a layer while our Marvelous designer model exists on another. With options to push and pull the sliders we may be able to recreate an interpretation of it (something i tried before to get a sense of scale). The Avastar plugin is python, the Viewer and Server are both c#. Singularity Viewer allows the avatar to be exported as both xml and as obj. The server can be used to locally model a catwalk in primitive shapes. The Second life avatar is i believe based on an original poser model and is CC license, I am wondering if cross sections of the avatar mesh (like the $350 d-torso mesh linked above) could be used. Svg shapes could be made, printed and assembled in a simliar manner (this is the objective I am considering) to make a mannequin based on measurements. I have been researching measuring obj models and the cheapest way we can all do it is using google sketchup 8 free, which is still downloadable and doesnt fall under Trimbles licensing laws, free can now be used commercially and “squaring off” can be acheived to perhaps obtain shapes…

Am I shooting in the dark here?

On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 10:00 PM, Susan Spencer < susan.spencer@gmail.com> wrote:

FYI, this is Body Labs’ proprietary solution for 3D scanning and pulling measurements from the reconstructed surface/avatar.


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